Plato
music–the liberal arts, a broad education in literature, civics, mathematics, and the sciences
gymnastic–physical education
athletics–competitive sport, in contrast to physical education
soul (nous, in Greek)–human essence; personality, mind, and spiritual qualities all combined into
one in Plato’s theory.
balance (sophrosyne, in Greek)–the tension between different qualities such as body and soul
that people, and societies, must seek.
misologist–a person who distrusts or hates reason (rational philosophy)
noble lie–a myth of human origins necessary to create a society
When should training in "gymnastic" begin, and how long should it last?
it should begin in childhood and it should last your whole life, not to be a warrior forever, but to be balanced
Does a sound body create a virtuous soul?
no its the opposite, a good soul provides the body with its own virtues so as to make it as good as it can be.
How should people take care of their bodies?
give adequate care to the intellect and turned over to it the concern for precise detail about the body, while we, so as not to talk too much, showed the way only to the models
What habits should they avoid?
drunkenness, too much sleep and sweets
What diets should they adopt?
No fish, no boiled meat, just roasted, no sweets
Are the habits of athletes what the polis needs to make great warriors?
yes, they are strong and tough willed, but they are too focused on the body and needs the intelligence without education to be in political power. the purpose in which it is in done, gymnastics should be for warfare training, not fun /prizes.
How does Homer factor into this story?
-he is referenced when speaking about diet and avoidance of sweets
- also mentioned when talking about what kind of diet they should eat and rather than having fish or boiled meat they had roasted because fire was easy for soldiers to come by rather than carry pots.
If simplicity in music produces moderation in souls, what does simplicity in gymnastic produce?
health in bodies
What is the difference in education through the physical vs. education of the physical? which one does plato like?
the difference is training vs. the outcomes are more than just your body is affected in exercise. all of the greek philosophers liked education through the physical because of the skills that come with exercise (health, lower heart rate, leadership skills, etc).
Should people use medicines to improve their health?
yes, but if it becomes obsessive that is the problem
What lesson does plato attempt to teach in the story of Herodicus, the "gymnastic master" who became sickly?
that he spent his whole life worrying about his body and health that he never made the impact he wanted to make by being so singularly minded
What lesson does Plato attempt to teach with the story about the carpenter?
that the medicine got him back to work so he could help his city
The purpose of the carpenter's health was toward what end or goal?
to get him back to work, back to producing goods, not necessarily feeling better
What does "excessive care of the body" produce?
if its over and above gymnastics, hinders it just about more than anything. and its troublesome in the management of a household.
- it makes any kind of learning, thought, or meditation by oneself hard, this care of the body in every way is a hinderance
- it make one suppose he's sick and never cease to take pains about his body
Does Plato think that the unfit and the diseased should be allowed to die off before they reproduce?
thinks that they can redeem themselves
Who is the good man, the man with the good soul or the good body?
the man with the good soul because he will realize that he needs a good body as well
Is the body or soul superior?
soul
What would Plato have society do with bad souls and bad bodies?
he would get rid of them; eugenics; it has to be curable, or they are left to die
What makes a person "soft"?
too much music
What makes a person "savage"?
too much gymnastics
What happens if you only practice music and not gymnastics?
you become soft and do not serve your city properly
What happens if you only improve the body or the soul?
you become too savage and you do not serve your soul properly
Are music and gymnastics ultimately designed to improve the body or the soul?
the soul
Should the rulers of the Republic be old or young men?
the rulers should be old and well tested men who have the wisdom to lead the city-state
What kind of tests should be created to find good rulers?
many tests throughout all of life, especially through childhood
What "noble lie" should be men are brothers, are some brothers better than others?
(a once upon a time story) that all men are equal or "brothers", but the good society realizes the bigger purpose to what their roles are. if you are a gold/ silver you are more vital to society compared to a copper or iron
Who are the gold, silver, bronze, and iron people?
these are products of their status in society
- silver, iron and bronze in the farmers and the other craftsmen.
If all men are brothers, are some brothers better than others?
no, but their roles are more important
How can plato tell your role in society?
it is not a hereditary system of talents, it is by fate or chance, but you can tell through the education that Plato is designing that will reveal where they are
Iron/ bronze men:
farmers and common folk
Silver people:
the "auxiliary" or the military
Gold people:
The leaders of the society; cannot have any private property
Why should the soldiers and rulers of the Republic be barred from owning property?
looking out for the interest of the population, so they do not become greedy or have any enemies, they are literally owned by the public